JRE 1560 · November 7, 2020

Mike Baker

militaryintelligencehistorycrimepolitics

Who is Mike Baker?

Mike Baker is a former CIA covert operations officer, host of the Science Channel series Black Files Declassified, and current president and cofounder of Diligence LLC, a global intelligence and security firm.

Topics and Timestamps

01Mike Baker discusses his career as a CIA covert operations officer and what that work actually entails versus Hollywood depictions
02Baker explains how intelligence agencies gather information and the ethical complexities of covert operations
03Conversation covers modern threats to national security and how intelligence agencies adapt to emerging challenges
04Baker shares insights into his current work with Diligence LLC and private sector intelligence operations
05Discussion touches on declassified operations and what the public doesn't understand about intelligence work
06Baker breaks down the difference between real espionage and the dramatized versions people see in movies and TV
▶Introduction and background on Mike Baker's CIA career0:00:00
▶Baker discusses the reality of covert operations versus Hollywood depictions0:05:00
▶Explanation of how intelligence gathering actually works in practice0:20:00
▶Discussion of modern threats and how agencies adapt to emerging challenges0:45:00
▶Baker talks about his current work with Diligence LLC and private sector intelligence1:15:00

The Show

Joe brings Mike Baker onto the show and immediately dives into what it's actually like working as a covert operations officer for the CIA. Baker doesn't hold back about the mundane reality versus what Hollywood sells people. Most of the work isn't explosive action sequences or car chases. It's methodical, calculated, and involves a lot of waiting around, paperwork, and coordination with other agencies. Baker explains how the intelligence community operates, the layers of oversight, and the constraints agents work under that most people have no idea about.

They get into the nitty gritty of how information is gathered, sources are developed, and operations are approved. Baker emphasizes that despite what you see in movies, there are actual rules and legal frameworks that govern what intelligence agencies can and cannot do, even though the public perception is that they're operating in some kind of lawless shadow world. He talks about the ethical weight of decisions made in the intelligence community and how those weigh on people who actually do the work.

The conversation shifts to modern threats and how intelligence agencies are scrambling to adapt to technology, cyber threats, and transnational criminal organizations. Baker gives his take on current geopolitical tensions and where the real vulnerabilities exist. He discusses his work with Diligence LLC and how the private sector intelligence game is different from government work, with different incentives and constraints.

Baker shares some declassified operations and explains why certain things remain classified, giving Joe and the audience a realistic window into why secrecy in intelligence isn't always about hiding malfeasance but about protecting methods, sources, and ongoing operations. He breaks down common misconceptions about what CIA actually does and doesn't do, and how much of what people think they know is shaped by fiction rather than reality.